ColdPoison is an independent vocalist and rapper from the vegan movement, and if you just rolled your eyes — honestly, that’s exactly the reaction he’s counting on. Because what comes next is a level of argumentation that makes you realize his music is a full-blown philosophical movement wrapped in a hip-hop package.

His latest single “Face Plant” is six thousand dollars of budget, a year of production, and direct, by-name callouts aimed at people within his own community. And his criticism isn’t even directed at the meat industry. It’s directed at his own people. The ones who, in his view, turned the idea of animal rights into a money-printing marketing machine. The man grinds at two warehouse jobs, sleeps like a soldier on the front line, hasn’t seen a dime of support from the very people he’s going to bat for — and still records a track and sends it to Billie Eilish. And gets dead silence in return.

I’ll be honest — locking down this interview wasn’t easy. ColdPoison isn’t the type to sit around waiting for media to reach out. He’s got his own rhythm, his own priorities, and small talk is clearly not high on the list. But we made it happen. And I’m glad we did, because this is one of those conversations where you sit there for a good twenty minutes afterwards just thinking.

We talked about money, about Billie’s silence, about why the vegan community hates him, about punk, hip-hop, and whether there’s even a single day when ColdPoison isn’t fighting something.

Spoiler: there isn’t.

Hey ColdPoison, it’s been just under six months since our last conversation, and here you are, coming back with a new single, FacePlant. So that all of our readers understand the scope of this: you spent six thousand dollars on this song — three producers, two vocalists, a pianist, a professional voice actor, a sound engineer with a combined twenty-four hours of total recording time — and all of that for a single track, which then, as it turned out, sat on the shelf for an entire year. Most indie artists could put out an album or even two on that kind of budget. Tell us — at what point did you realize this track demanded that scale of production, and was there a single day over the course of that year when you thought: “Maybe I went too far”?

I realized immediately that Face Plant required a massive budget as I knew I was going face-to-face against two problems. First, a company whose investors spent millions in starting up their plant-based charade. By relativity alone, my resources were just a drop in the bucket against their power and influence. Secondly, I’m going up against more than just a corporation. I’m going up against a lack of accountability itself. The mode of transportation we find ourselves fighting said struggle is through fast-food here, but make no mistake, this is a broader issue that all social movements grapple with. We call it “in-fighting” instead of holding basic moral standards. We call it “destructive” instead of “corrective”. And grappling with such a strongly baked-in psychological default of choosing defensiveness over superior philosophical growth is exactly what called for multiple ‘fighters’, if you will. Accountability has no price tag, and it’s a shame that having to fight for it requires any at all. If anything, this all demonstrates that my financial efforts were undercut, not overshot. That’s exactly why I won’t stop spreading its message until the world lets down its defenses for the right kind of message, not compromised or ‘safe’ but philosophically dangerous ones, to prevail. I will say, I think the closest I got to “Maybe I went too far”? was something like “is this track too ahead of its time”? But that’s what caused me to feel inspired, and honored to be the first to share this specific kind of message. Someone has to break the mold and take the social hit for it. Someone has to be willing to be hated for changing the tone on animal rights from ‘diluted’ to ‘unashamed’. And as much as I am honored in a sense to be the first of my kind to do so, I am simultaneously disappointed that the movement’s silence had to force my hand . But I’ll be damned if I drop into these fake hands.

You sent the track to Billie Eilish. She’s one of the most publicly visible vegans in pop music, and from what you’ve said, you’re fairly certain she heard it. But… from her end, you apparently received zero response. What gave you more fuel — the fact that the track likely reached her, or her silence?

It’s funny, at first, it was a large source of my fuel. Not sole source, but more of like a hybrid-EV. While recording, I was genuinely in belief she’d resonate with the whole piece. I’d seen a documentary once of her hating that fast-food companies target low-income individuals. I’d seen her reject the industry standards and status quo on what beauty, fame, and morals ought look like. She’s issued ethical ultimatums, like the famous Met Gala fashion statement of ceasing fur sales. She’s demanded her arenas offer only vegan options during her concerts. And she’s generally an outspoken and intelligent woman who makes the current underdog of social movements known as animal rights look cool. But my fuel started to run low. Not because of my financial hardships eating me up. No. See, I thought those would be irrelevant as long as someone as fortunate as Billie saw I had talent. Saw my passion, my genuine similarities to her emotionally on the whole subject. I mean, here I was, taking on someone like Matt Plitch, a man who exploited a neighborhood of Portland known for low-income. A man who owns major stakes in a cow-exploiting company: Neutral Foods. A man who said that a plant-based chain attempting to “take down McDonalds” is NOT trying to convert anybody regarding Veganism. But we are, aren’t we, Billie? Why are we enriching people who exploit animals both personally AND commercially? Who make zero commitment to animal rights? Who commodify it, then disregard even human rights by taking advantage of those most likely to become obese or unhealthy from it? I work two full-time warehouse jobs and barely sleep just to have money left over to invest into the movement after basic living expenses. I’ve not received a dollar thus far from anyone donating to me so I can pursue animal rights full-time, not even within my own movement. In fact, the current movement seems to generally hate me for being profoundly outspoken and willing to be patient with people who argue against what’s right instead of manipulative and sanitized. I’m not angry at her. I’m sad. And I just ask, as I usually do being the self-reflecting philosopher that I am: If you’re a hundred-millionaire, why are you a hundred millionaire?

In the track, you go after specific people by name. That’s an approach rooted in the battle rap tradition, but the context here is radically different: you’re hitting figures within your own community. The vegan scene is small. Everyone knows each other. A diss inside the community is almost like a family argument in the kitchen where every neighbor can hear. Were you bracing for part of the vegan community to take their side? And if so — what did that preparation look like?

Ah, a family analogy. How insightful is that? There’s an idea there, of ideology, isn’t there? I get a strong vibe of “I’ll help you hide the body” instead of “report you to the police for being a murderer” when I think of “family”. And so, I think your framing delivers an excellently accurate connotation. When you say, “where every neighbor can hear”, I think of how socially, we shame others for situations where we occasionally see brave souls hold high expectations instead of choosing peace and serenity regardless of moral atrocities those around us may be succumbing to. We call passion “noise”, “anger” and “blind”. And when we set the standards for anyone to be allowed to run morally freely, unconditionally accepted as long as they hold a certain title, we’ve come around full-circle. Those that love you expect the most from you, not the least. Instead of looking at each other with special titles we’ve boasted for others or ourselves to the point where we think we deserve special treatment on the status of any given moral view, we ought to just see logical consequences. Is this thing, this decision, good or bad? Not “who said it”? Unfortunately, I more than expected the vegan community to take their side. The movement is beyond confused, those at the top are tainted largely by money, fame, and ego. That complacency is followed down the chain. That’s why my plea in the chorus is “we don’t want to believe it’s fake”. Nobody wants to admit that a spot where you can make memories and the food actually labeled “plant-based” can still be a poor moral decision. People, regardless of their self-title as ‘vegan’, still want convenience. They are still prone to social norms and will bend logical consistency until it breaks so that its fragments can artificially look like they fit into the puzzle of society. They are stagnating. My only preparation looks like what it always looks like. Be honest about what I would accept in the human context and not settle for less in the animal context unless I can name a trait that morally differentiates the two, then challenge the world to do the same.

Rap is a genre historically tied to cash, domination, flexing on steaks and furs. You walk into that space carrying philosophical arguments, debate challenges, references to speciesism. Meanwhile, the average rap listener opens Spotify to nod their head to a beat and closes it three minutes later. Do you ever get the feeling that you’re delivering a lecture in a club where everyone came to dance — and that the rap audience, by and large, simply isn’t the right recipient for what you’re trying to say?

It might be correct to say that the current average rap listenerfeels the sentiment you just described. And perhaps the imagery for when someone says the word “rap” is more fitting for said frivolous pursuits. I think the answer isn’t to say I am attempting to fit a current mold that exists. I mean, it’d be quite silly to pretend my music is comparable to your casual Drake or Nicki Minaj track. But “rap” is an exceedingly large genre. One that has the likes of Hopsin and Joyner Lucas in it. Conscious Hip-Hop has always been my favorite subcategory, and even within that I am automatically more alternative just by sheer virtue of the fact that animal rights are an extremely undersaturated topic to discuss. My goal, however, is to broaden the definition of rap for those who think too narrowly on the term and jump to the aforementioned club rappers by making conscious hip-hop more popular in general. And while my emphasis will always be on animal rights, being reflective, intentional, and deep within music ought be a way society grows regardless of the theme. I like to think of Michael Jackson as a philosopher of love, for example. His song, “Remember the Time” is an incredibly philosophical piece despite not approaching it the way I might lyrically. Rap is a very direct way to make points and it’s a powerful medium we can use as thought-leaders to reach a massive audience. Having said all of that, I still value melodies, vocals, rhythm, and overall sound quality so I certainly think that whatever minor bother people might receive on one end from being intellectually stimulating is strongly offset by dope beats, beautiful voices that contrast hard flows, and dynamic changes throughout to keep the listener engaged. 

And still, I keep coming back to this. The audience expects an entirely different type of provocation — money, status, sex. You’re essentially hijacking someone else’s vehicle and steering it in your own direction. Did you study how the vegan message functioned in punk and hardcore, and consciously decide that hip-hop would carry it further — or did you just happen to be a rapper who had something to say, and the genre chose you?

Well, a little of both I guess, haha. No, I think it’s more so the first than the second. I did grow up with a love for alternative rap, as the first ever rap I heard was from DeStorm, a YouTube rapper. I then discovered EpicLloyd from the Epic Rap Battles of History and eventually Hopsin. Those three became my main inspirations for hip-hop. I have heard a bit of Joyner Lucas, George Watsky, and Eminem, but admittedly, I’ve not gotten a chance to dive very deep into much other rap. I became vegan at 15, though, and so, although a love for rap came a bit sooner, my ambition to spread the message of animal rights was the stronger of the two ambitions. Also, hijacked is a bit negative sounding. Let’s say I… commandeered… a Nissan Leaf… and took the genre down a road that the passengers weren’t expecting but were more pleasantly surprised when I showed them the GPS of where they were heading instead. 

You mentioned that you originally planned a full music video. Six thousand on production, a year of waiting — and the visual component stayed locked inside your head. Every artist has a phantom project that exists in its entirety, but only in the imagination. Sometimes that phantom is more powerful than what actually came out. Describe the video you saw. What was the first scene?

Ah, yes. OK, so, I’m going through the crowd of all these excited people and ask what’s going on. Someone says “Face Plant just opened up! See?” And then Molly Baz and Matt Plitch are standing out there with their name tags and FacePlant shirts and Matt says “Remember, we aren’t trying to convert anybody. The fact that it’s plant-based should be an afterthought. Also, if you or your loved ones would like to support my Neutral Milk, that would be greatly appreciated” And then Molly Baz cuts in excitedly “and his milk goes REAALLY great with my lactation cookies! Also, you guys should all buy my all-natural, personally made, UNIQUE FORMULA of MAYO!! Only $2 an ounce!” The music then starts to fade in when I turn to the others in the group and ask “wait, what? Did you hear that? They’re not trying to convert anybody into veganism?” and the person next to me says “yeah, I mean, who cares? It’s saving animals, isn’t it?”, another person turns around “Yeah, look at all the good they’re doing!”, another person says “HEY, YEAH, DON’T YOU SEE HOW MUCH GOOD THEY’VE DONE? YOU’RE SO UNGRATEFUL!” Large indistinct chatter begins with them all saying different things to echo the same sentiment like “The vegan community is stronger now!” or “maybe they get one thing right or wrong, it’s the bigger picture that counts!” and then I break away when the music gets louder and angrily start to walk away, looking towards the different aspects of the building/Matt and Molly’s other pursuits (like Ayoh Mayo or Neutral Foods) and begin walking into the sidewalk by the time the vocals start where I do a one-take on each verse.

In the outro, you shift to a calm voice and address the reaction you consider the most toxic of all: “look at how much good they’ve done.” That phrase is familiar to anyone who has ever tried to start an uncomfortable conversation within their own circle — in a family, at a workplace, in a fandom. People cling to the collective positive because accountability is frightening. You’re asking the vegan community to do the thing that is psychologically the hardest — to take an honest look at their own. Have you ever encountered a single community — in music, sports, anywhere — that went through that kind of self-correction and came out stronger? Or is this more of an ideal you’re calling people toward, knowing that getting there is almost impossible?

That’s a wonderful way of putting it, I’m very keen to your phrasing there. Yes, psychologically the hardest, but philosophically, the most desirable goal. And so, it motivates us. Both the ones who already take the initiative, and those who want to deep down but are afraid. That inner voice needs a platform. It’s not non-existent. It’s just often overshadowed by societal norms. Indoctrination. I think previous civil rights movements went through this exact ideal and came out on top by putting philosophy first. Look no further than Black rights or women’s rights, when the abolitionists led the way. The north divided against the south in America because reductionist approaches for Black people wasn’t acceptable. Women’s equality was not won by the remonstrants who preferred indirect influence and protective treatment to equal political citizenship, but by suffragists who insisted that sex itself could not justify disenfranchisement. Similarly, animal rights ought be fought for with a sufficient level of responsibility if there’s no morally-relevant symmetry breaker between them and the prior groups such to that it ought warrant a different approach. It’s always difficult, that much is true. And it’s always more worth it, as well.

ColdPoison — is that a character, an alter ego, or simply you under a stage name? Some artists say a pseudonym is liberating — it lets them say things the person behind it would be too afraid to. Is there something ColdPoison can afford to do that you, in everyday life, cannot?

Thankfully, I can say I am ColdPoison. I’ve successfully lost enough relationships and sacrificed plenty of time that I could have spent indulging in hedonistic pursuits, such that I have proven my commitment to truth and philosophy as a way of life. And my stage name is symbolic of such. It says that I’m more than just a guy with a set of blue and purple eyes like Danny Phantom going ghost or Jimmy Neutron having a brain blast. I’m someone who says that truth ought to be something you are confronted with, “ready” or not. I don’t believe in deliberately watering it down, rationing it into ‘palatable’ doses, or taking the scenic route toward what deserves to be said plainly. The cold is the truth striking you immediately; the poison is what happens when you run from it and carry it with you. It lingers, works beneath your defenses, and eventually makes the confrontation unavoidable. My charge is not to delay the truth, but to deny people an escape from it.

You held onto this track for a year. Over the course of that year, the plant-based industry went through falling stock prices, closures, rebrands. The context shifted. And here’s where I have an honest argument for you: some of the people you mention in the track lost their footing on their own over that year. The market moved them aside without your help. A skeptic would say you showed up to a conversation that was already half over. Convince me I’m wrong. Why does this track hit harder today than it would have a year ago?

I would say we are having a different conversation. The point of Face Plant isn’t to say that a place that happens to be plant-based might fail for some reason or another. It’s to say that any place that’s technically plant-based but NOT pro-animal rights or at least neutral, morally deserves to be out of business. So, it’s not an attack on plant-based foods, it’s an attack on plant-based philosophy. Where my opposition’s point is to trivialize or make the concept of plant-based eating irrelevant, the whole point of the vegan movement is to achieve animal rights by eating plant-based. We share a common factor, but our underlying goal couldn’t be farther apart. And this is the issue with plant-based establishments. The increase of plant-based foods doesn’t necessarily mean an increase in animal rights. There are all sorts of situations where plant-based interest increases, but the ethics of the beings in question do not. That’s actually our pain point. The reverse is expected, as, in order to increase animal rights, you necessarily have to increase plant-based products (or non-animal based products if we’re being really technical). But the two variables here are not reverse-compatible in producing shared causal increases, unfortunately. 

You end your letter with the phrase “ColdPoison doesn’t stop fighting. I’ll keep pushing no matter who oppresses me or how many stack against me.” That’s the energy of someone waging a campaign on multiple fronts simultaneously — against the industry, against the fakes inside the movement, against indifference. This is the kind of question people rarely ask someone in that state of mind, because it feels almost out of place: What does your day look like when you decide to fight absolutely nothing? And do days like that even exist?

I think when you fight absolutely nothing, you can be calm internally, and all while chaos around you continues in reality. That kind of space is something others call “peace,” and I call “hell.” I cannot imagine dissociating from the dangers, sophistry, pain, tragedy, and overall evil of the world and not feeling absolutely disgusted with myself. Standing idly by as I know animals are dying is a task I will not pretend to engage in, and so the reality always continues in the back of my mind no matter the task, and at the forefront when I can help it. Even on non-animal rights matters, I’m just simply incompatible with pure hedonism. Someone’s emotional pain, trauma, or otherwise will always take precedence for me over laughter and fun. Joyful moments ought not to be fixated upon, else we lose sight of all the hidden pain of others buried beneath our own smiles. Happiness is a finite resource we cannot hijack all for one group and leave nothing left over for others, if our goal is to be logically consistent about sentient beings’ deservance of it. Empathy requires sacrifice. And if all gave it, we’d all have to sacrifice a lot less while enjoying a lot more.

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